I have a white german shepherd female, and i was wondering if i chose to breed her with a male german shepherd, what would the outcome be?
Would they be creamy colored? White? Tan? Or look like a regular gsd that has been bleached?
You get a horrible bloody mess or a wrecked cake mixer or a very sore stirring arm, depending on the power of what you used to do the mixing….
But being serious:
You don’t supply enough information about the genetic background.
You possibly even misled us as to the dog’s coat – "black" means self-black, no tan visible. But most GSDs are black-&-tan, either as sables or as saddle-marked.
The self-black GSD (but not a self-black Labrador) has a^ a^ at the Agouti locus, but we don’t know from your question whether he carries one of the recessives that, when paired, block black pigment.
Your white GSD has e^ e^ at the Extension locus, to block the black pigment, and a pair of whatever in GSDs blocks the tan pigment (for lack of a name we’re calling it c^d c^d, but now know that that is the wrong gene series for it), but we don’t know what she has at the Agouti locus. For all we know, she too could be an a^ a^ self-black (but with the black pigment blocked off), but more likely is that she has one allele for wolf-sable and one allele for saddle-marked
All 3 alleles – a^ c^d e^ – are recessives, which means they don’t take effect unless the pup inherits a pair, one from each parent.
If the black dog carries a single copy of c^d and of e^ (as he MUST do if one of his parents is a white), half the pups (± random chance) will be self-white.
If the black dog carries a single e^ and the white bit.ch carries a single a^, about a quarter of the pups will be self-white.
If the black dog carries no e^ and the white bit.ch is genetically a black (but with the black pigment blocked off by her e^ e^), all the pups will be self-black (except that there is a possibility that both parents used for such a mating are likely to carry for liver or for blue, and so some of those self-black pups might be either self-liver or self-blue).
If the black dog carries no e^ and the white bit.ch carries no a^ then none of the pups will be black, none of them white. It is likely that half (± random chance) will be sable, the other half saddle-marked; but as I said, we don’t KNOW what her genetic background is in the Agouti series.
Because of the modifiers that breeders of self-whites tend to collect, it is likely that any non-white pups will have a pale tan, going white inside the thighs & under the belly, and probably their black area will shrink during the first 2 years.
But what you have to realise is that, as with ALL the sheep herding breeds, all GSDs are REQUIRED to have black on at least their back and their "leathers" (eye rims, nose, lips, pads). That rule is strictly enforced in Germany & Australia, so no-one there can register a GSD as white or liver or blue or Isabella or "panda". And therefore they cannot register a pup from an off-coloured parent. People from all around the world strive to import those correctly-bred GSDs registered in Germany. Only about 6% of AKC-regd GSDs are off-colours, and the percentage is lower in other countries. The only internationally approved Standard of the GSD can be downloaded from the FCI’s web-site: http://www.fci.be/uploaded_files/166A1991_en.doc
North America has 3 members on the WUSV, the organisation that modified & approved that Standard – they come from the GSDCAmerica, the USCA, and the GSSCC.
Your white bit.ch should be a loved pet, possibly a competitor in Agility, Flyball, Obedience, Rally O; but not regarded as a breeding proposition as a GSD – however, if all her ancestors for 6 generations are registered as white (UKC registration doesn’t count), you are welcome to migrate to Switzerland and try re-registering her as a Berger Blanc Suisse; but none of the English-speaking KCs intend to recognise that breed.
Les P, owner of GSD_Friendly: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/GSD_Friendly
"In GSDs" as of 1967
You will most likely have a litter of everything: a white dog, a tan/black one and perhaps one with traits of both. Please make sure you have homes for all of them as we have enough homeless dogs.
I have three GSDs; two are from shelters.
References :
White is a RECESSIVE.
If the dog does carry the gene,the pups will NOT show white,but will carry the defect!
WHITE is a MAJOR/DISQUALIFYING *FAULT*! Don’t make more crap!
References :
Tryin’ Again is correct–white is a fault. Spay her now!
References :
depends on if the male carries the gene for white or not.
Most likely the outcome would be tan puppies that carry a gene for white.
There’s more important aspects to breeding than trying to figure out what color the pups will be.. conformation, health, temperment and working ability are far more important.
References :
You get a horrible bloody mess or a wrecked cake mixer or a very sore stirring arm, depending on the power of what you used to do the mixing….
But being serious:
You don’t supply enough information about the genetic background.
You possibly even misled us as to the dog’s coat – "black" means self-black, no tan visible. But most GSDs are black-&-tan, either as sables or as saddle-marked.
The self-black GSD (but not a self-black Labrador) has a^ a^ at the Agouti locus, but we don’t know from your question whether he carries one of the recessives that, when paired, block black pigment.
Your white GSD has e^ e^ at the Extension locus, to block the black pigment, and a pair of whatever in GSDs blocks the tan pigment (for lack of a name we’re calling it c^d c^d, but now know that that is the wrong gene series for it), but we don’t know what she has at the Agouti locus. For all we know, she too could be an a^ a^ self-black (but with the black pigment blocked off), but more likely is that she has one allele for wolf-sable and one allele for saddle-marked
All 3 alleles – a^ c^d e^ – are recessives, which means they don’t take effect unless the pup inherits a pair, one from each parent.
If the black dog carries a single copy of c^d and of e^ (as he MUST do if one of his parents is a white), half the pups (± random chance) will be self-white.
If the black dog carries a single e^ and the white bit.ch carries a single a^, about a quarter of the pups will be self-white.
If the black dog carries no e^ and the white bit.ch is genetically a black (but with the black pigment blocked off by her e^ e^), all the pups will be self-black (except that there is a possibility that both parents used for such a mating are likely to carry for liver or for blue, and so some of those self-black pups might be either self-liver or self-blue).
If the black dog carries no e^ and the white bit.ch carries no a^ then none of the pups will be black, none of them white. It is likely that half (± random chance) will be sable, the other half saddle-marked; but as I said, we don’t KNOW what her genetic background is in the Agouti series.
Because of the modifiers that breeders of self-whites tend to collect, it is likely that any non-white pups will have a pale tan, going white inside the thighs & under the belly, and probably their black area will shrink during the first 2 years.
But what you have to realise is that, as with ALL the sheep herding breeds, all GSDs are REQUIRED to have black on at least their back and their "leathers" (eye rims, nose, lips, pads). That rule is strictly enforced in Germany & Australia, so no-one there can register a GSD as white or liver or blue or Isabella or "panda". And therefore they cannot register a pup from an off-coloured parent. People from all around the world strive to import those correctly-bred GSDs registered in Germany. Only about 6% of AKC-regd GSDs are off-colours, and the percentage is lower in other countries. The only internationally approved Standard of the GSD can be downloaded from the FCI’s web-site: http://www.fci.be/uploaded_files/166A1991_en.doc
North America has 3 members on the WUSV, the organisation that modified & approved that Standard – they come from the GSDCAmerica, the USCA, and the GSSCC.
Your white bit.ch should be a loved pet, possibly a competitor in Agility, Flyball, Obedience, Rally O; but not regarded as a breeding proposition as a GSD – however, if all her ancestors for 6 generations are registered as white (UKC registration doesn’t count), you are welcome to migrate to Switzerland and try re-registering her as a Berger Blanc Suisse; but none of the English-speaking KCs intend to recognise that breed.
Les P, owner of GSD_Friendly: http://pets.groups.yahoo.com/group/GSD_Friendly
"In GSDs" as of 1967
References :